We’re in Manhattan, sitting in a Lower East Side backyard, and BENEE is telling PAPER concerning the hole between her newest album, Ur an Angel I’m Just Particles, launched earlier this month, and her critically acclaimed debut, Hey u x, which she shared in 2020.
“At the start, I was trying to make something faster,” she says of her time in Los Angeles working with Buddy Ross (Haim, Frank Ocean). “He’s a legend, and he brought up the album Blonde. He was like, ‘Do you know how long that album took to make?’ He assured me that good things take time, which I think is a cliché. But unfortunately, it’s true. It feels like you have to release to stay relevant. At the start, I felt that pressure, but then slowly I started to accept that it was just how I was going to work. I could only make it better if I really sat down intentionally with this album. It’s an important one.”
Slowing down was fruitful for the New Zealand-born singer-songwriter, main her to write down one of many first songs from the album, “Heaven.” “It was one of the earlier ones I made that I felt was setting a good tone and felt intentional,” she says. “I felt as though I was actually saying something. I was doing a bunch of sessions and writing songs that felt the most meaningful and important, then putting them together and creating the storyline. That’s when I had that awakening. I knew what the story was and what I was trying to say. That’s important.”
Where her greatest hits, just like the double-platinum, bedroom-pop anthem “Supalonely” and different radio mainstay “Glitter,” may be seen as bubbly get together tracks, Ur an Angel dives into existential dread, grappling with the fleeting nature of existence. For BENEE, it was essential to not remake what she’d already carried out. “You don’t keep making the same thing,” she says. “It’s the evolution of an artist. I went into sessions in L.A. with people who wanted to recreate [‘Supalonely’], and every time it was so lame. It was so bad. I don’t think I can precalculate a hit. I can’t chase it. I don’t want it, even. I want big tours and big shows with big productions, but I don’t think I can chase a hit.”
Instead, she’s chasing authenticity — whether or not it’s working with fellow inventive genre-pushers like PinkPantheress on her new observe “Princess” or spending her time studying Stephen Hawking. Ur an Angel might have began as a cyclical examine on the ephemeral nature of issues, however on the subject of how she needs folks to really feel once they hear it, she needs them to really feel very a lot alive. “I want them to enter another world,” she says. “This album was so intentional, which I haven’t done yet. This one is cohesive. I’m already thinking of future projects. This one is narrative. I’m following themes of obsession, breakdown, chaos and ascent — in that order. That’s the story, and those are the changes.”
Below, BENEE talks about Ur an Angel I’m Just Particles, grappling with the success of her first album, and the great thing about feeling each emotion.
Ur An Angel I’m Just Particles comes out on November 7. And you launched your final album in 2020? That’s insane!
It’s tousled.
Well … it’s not that a lot time in precise life. But for the music business, with folks continuously placing issues out, how did that point really feel for you? Was it vital? Rewarding?
At the beginning, I used to be making an attempt to make one thing a bit sooner. Then I made a bunch of songs and it wasn’t hitting. I slowed down after just a few periods. I used to be speaking to producers they usually inspired me that it was positive. I labored with Buddy Ross, he’s a legend, and he introduced up the album, Blonde. He labored with Frank. He was like, “Do you know how long that album took to make?” He assured me that good issues take time, which I feel is a cliché. But sadly, it’s true. You can get absorbed by the tempo by which the streaming strikes at. It looks like you need to launch to remain related. At the beginning, I felt that stress however then slowly I began to just accept that it was simply how I used to be going to work. I might solely make it higher if I actually sat down deliberately with this album. It’s an essential one.
What tune or second had been you capable of see that shift from pushing to make an album to when it began flowing?
“Heaven” was one of many first songs. It was one of many earlier ones I made for this album that I felt was setting a superb tone and made it really feel extra intentional. I felt as if I used to be truly saying one thing. It was doing a bunch of periods and having songs that felt probably the most significant and essential, then placing them collectively and creating the storyline. That’s once I had that awakening. I knew what the story was and what I used to be making an attempt to say. That’s essential. I used to be making a number of demos the place I didn’t know what I used to be saying.
What made the story come collectively for you? How do you know it was going to unfold into the album?
After shifting to LA — I’ve been there for nearly three years — once I moved there, I felt so misplaced and confused and overwhelmed by this whole life swap. I used to be remoted and began to ask all these large questions. Like, “What is life?” I learn a guide by Stephen Hawking, and had a lightbulb second. I used to be like, “Why am I worried about all these stupid little things in life?” That allowed me to get deeper and ensure I used to be saying issues that I felt had been essential and useful on this local weather. There are a lot of issues happening, a lot of horrible issues, and it’s essential as artists to have pure intention. For me, a approach to cope is by having a childlike surprise lens or a fantastical world that I can escape into. That was what I wished to do. I wished to make that world for folks in no matter method I might. That was a swap for me.
This rattling properly may be heaven.
What made the story come collectively for you? How do you know it was going to unfold into the album?
After shifting to LA — I’ve been there for nearly three years — once I moved there, I felt so misplaced and confused and overwhelmed by this whole life swap. I used to be remoted and began to ask all these large questions. Like, “What is life?” I learn a guide by Stephen Hawking, and had a lightbulb second. I used to be like, “Why am I worried about all these stupid little things in life?” That allowed me to get deeper and ensure I used to be saying issues that I felt had been essential and useful on this local weather. There are a lot of issues happening, a lot of horrible issues, and it’s essential as artists to have pure intention. For me, a approach to cope is by having a childlike surprise lens or a fantastical world that I can escape into. That was what I wished to do. I wished to make that world for folks in no matter method I might. That was a swap for me.
Which Stephen Hawking guide? What was it about it?
It’s a terrific guide, Brief Answers to the Big Questions. He’s giving his predictions for what the long run would possibly appear to be, whether or not it’s house journey or AI expertise. It’s fairly good to listen to a perspective from a wise individual, a scientist and for me, I hadn’t gotten that earlier than. I completed college once I was 17. I went to varsity for 2 weeks after which dropped out. But I like studying stuff you go to high school to review. It sucks now, I imply I like music and I do know loads about it, and I’ve develop into very woke. I’m very deep and religious. But I feel studying one thing from that world was actually enlightening and provoking. It’s essential to know concerning the local weather and the whole lot happening and what we’re doing. One of his theories is that human destruction would possibly occur earlier than we even journey wherever. But yeah, I wished to learn it as a result of I used to be asking the massive questions.
Do you are feeling just like the overwhelm you had once you first moved to Los Angeles has gone down? Or have you ever begun dealing with it in another way?
It’s gone down considerably however I nonetheless get fairly homesick. Having a neighborhood and a accomplice makes it loads simpler to manage. But I feel the primary couple years, I used to be undoubtedly feeling fairly remoted. It’s like going to a brand new college and also you’re like “Fuck, I need to make friends.” All my associates had been in New Zealand. LA was a bizarre place to seek out associates as a result of I felt like I used to be attracting fairly bizarre folks. There had been a few folks I needed to minimize off. Everyone warned me about it and I used to be so naive. I used to be like, “They’re so nice!” But I received a impolite awakening. I used to be sitting in that loneliness, which was useful in a method. I used to be compelled to surprise why I’m right here and what I’m doing and it made me take into consideration my music loads deeper.
I’m from the South and shifting right here, to New York, folks warn you about folks, and it is nonetheless surprising. You’re like, “Wait a minute …”
There are so many weirdos. I’m like, “Do you want to be my friend? What do you want? What are you gonna do?” It’s odd that people don’t want a genuine connection. It feels like an illusion.
Right. Then genuine people get left with the dance of balancing letting people in so you meet the good ones but also maintaining boundaries to protect themselves.
There’s a lot of isolation. I think of the lonely poet. I’m a lonely musician. Which is fine. I’m not lonely, but there are times when I feel alone. But it makes me think about everyone who is an immigrant or a refugee. Anyone who has to leave their family or home to find a safer life. For me, it’s a privileged version of that. I’m doing a job where I have so much freedom, but it’s really hard. Anyone who’s moved anywhere knows it’s hard. I can’t just go over to my mom’s house and I’m so close with her. I call her every day. It’s also just growing up. That’s what this album is, though. It’s growing up and waking up to these big questions that I don’t actually have the answers to.
I was forced to wonder why I’m here and what I’m doing and it made me think about my music a lot deeper.
A lot of the album is you making sense of the world. Do you feel like you’re getting better at finding some of these answers? Or making better sense of the world through this album?
I think so. It’s good to just learn all the time. That’s what life’s about. It’s just lessons and maybe we end up coming to some kind of conclusion or resolution at the end. But yes, living in the emotion and being able to be sad is important. Feel it and come out of it. Humans are so complex and life is so beautiful. I’ve come to love it so much, even though there’s stuff that’s sad. This damn well might be heaven.
That’s funny. I’ve never thought about it like that. I’ve thought maybe it was hell.
I know. But what if it is heaven? I think for some people it is hell, but there are days when I’m just like, this is so serene and beautiful. We have plants and nature and little animals that just want us to be happy. We have people who are smiling. What could be better than that?
I go back and forth between thinking about life deeply and knowing I need to just enjoy it. Like, just watch the movie. You don’t need to analyze it. But I’m like, “I have to write down what’s happening. I have to read the script.”
But how much fun is it to think and wonder? That’s the childlike wonder thing. I love that lens for life.
What was the first song you knew would be on Ur an Angel, I’m Just Particles?
It was either “Heaven” or “Sad Boiii.” Those were the earlier ones, both made with New Zealand producers. “Heaven” I made on an island in New Zealand. I stayed in the bush with Josh Fountain who I made a lot of my earlier music with. I wrote it when I lost my granddad. That was such a crazy time because that experience of losing someone and thinking about life and death might have triggered a lot of craziness for me. It was a weird feeling. I was looking at my skin and being like, “What are we? What the fuck is going on here?” Losing someone was also a weird awakening, where I realized we only have a little bit of time. And it’s fast, whatever we’re doing right now. It doesn’t last long. I think you can dwell on things your whole life, but not knowing and wondering what we’re doing on this rock becomes overwhelming and scary. You have to make it a party. You have to watch the movie and drink the wine and eat the fucking bread and swim in the ocean. And that is my Ted Talk.
You have a collab with PinkPantheress. How did it come together?
I made it with a producer named Sly. It happened so quickly. He had 20 minutes at the end of a session and we wrote the song. It’s a fantastical, feel-good anthem. I was walking into the party and owning the space, but also was like, “Why is my man looking at her?” That extreme arrogance was taken over by a feeling of extreme anger. Those kinds of emotions are fun to write about. I had the song and knew I wanted a feature. I had some potential candidates but Pink was at the top of my list. She has such a good ear for melodies and lyrics. We’re in the same circle in LA so I texted her asking. It’s always a bit weird reaching out, but I get it because sometimes people send me demos and I’m like, “I don’t know how I’m going to make this better.” I don’t need folks to consider that as a rejection. But anyhow, she hit me again and despatched me the stems and I used to be like, “Thanks, bro.”
She’s extraordinary. She’s on one other wave.
She’s hilarious. She’s received a humorous persona. She’s onto one thing actually distinctive which is tremendous inspiring. Also, coming from the UK the place there’s a humorousness is fucking sick. She added a lot to the tune. We’re gonna make a cool video in LA with an enormous, pink, inflatable fort with a rave inside. It’s gonna be sick.
You’re music can be very distinctive. How do you keep true to your self whereas collaborating with others … holding issues new, with out having different folks’s sounds seep into your mind?
It’s bizarre. Lots of us artists work as sponges, absorbing issues round us and spitting out a product of that. It’s actually essential to protect your personal sound. I hear a lot stuff now that sounds the identical. You can hearken to one thing and say it appears like Sabrina Carpenter or PinkPantheress. For me, once I’m listening to new music, if one thing sounds good I do know I can hearken to it ao I don’t need to make it. The style of a few of my earlier stuff wound up getting tremendous overdone. The indie-pop with the funk. At the time, we had been getting requests to make extra of it. That’s why I didn’t, as a result of all of it ended up the identical. That’s how the world works although. I prefer to make one thing new. Something I haven’t carried out or haven’t heard. Even if that’s taking components from different artists, the power can translate and never copy. It’s exhausting to do. But once I was making songs, for a very long time, within the first 12 months, so lots of them had been type of hyperpop. I used to be having enjoyable and other people favored it. Then folks received sick of it and I noticed it wasn’t a vibe. It wasn’t timeless and I didn’t really feel something from listening to it. I might have saved releasing that nevertheless it wouldn’t have carried out a lot.
Let’s discuss “Cinnamon,” because it was the primary introduction to this period for many individuals. How did this tune come to you? What had been you hoping to translate with it?
I labored on it with Ryan Raines, a producer in LA. He’s a drummer and my drummer, Felix, who I tour with, he had met Ryan whereas we had been out on tour. Ryan was enjoying with Dominic Fike on the time. When I got here to LA and received the chance to work with Ryan, Felix was like, “I know Ryan!” and it was only a small world second. I like him. We made just a few songs from the album collectively. He’s such a sort man.
That actually sticks with you, when persons are very nice.
Well, it’s what I’m used to, particularly once I began making music. I used to be working with Josh and fairly just a few collaborators. They’re all so variety and nerdy in the easiest way. In the way in which I’m. So a lot of music is ego and other people with humongous egos. With Ryan, we by no means know what we’re doing for the primary couple of minutes, however then it finally ends up rolling out and sounding good. I like working with him. It’s such a snug setup. He’s tremendous proficient and has a very good air about the whole lot. I can inform him precisely what I would like. “Cinnamon” was my first tune writing concerning the LA expertise and getting there and being messed round by a pair folks. I knew I wasn’t meant to be getting handled like this. It was a impolite awakening. In the refrain, it’s this bizarre breath and let go the place I’m like “This is what it is,” and I’ve to seek out some peace in it. I needed to be content material realizing that it’s the place I’m meant to be proper now. I saved saying “Ride the wave.” I received a bit depressed, secretly. It crept up on me.
Sometimes I don’t understand I used to be depressed till after, after which I’m like “Oh.”
Right? I used to be smoking weed a lot the primary 12 months or two and now I’ve give up. I believed I used to be being actually productive however I wasn’t. That tune, to me, is de facto significant. It looks like all these feelings I used to be having these first few years being in a brand new setting.
We talked a bit bit your early sound and tracks like “Supalonely” and that prime. Everyone wished to leap on that and make one thing comparable. Was it exhausting to maneuver away from that sound? How do you look again on that point? How do you create new issues when folks love an unique concept?
It’s odd. I’m even responsible about saying that about artists’ first albums. But it’s not the way it works. You don’t maintain making the identical factor. It’s the evolution of an artist. I undoubtedly have heard that tune and wished to return to these indie vibes and that natural, New Zealand sound. But I went into periods in LA with individuals who wished to recreate it, and each time it was so lame. It was so unhealthy. I don’t assume I can precalculate successful. I can’t chase it. I don’t need it, even. I would like huge excursions and massive reveals with huge productions, however I don’t assume I can chase that hit. After releasing it, it sucked seeing folks come out after which swap on me and name it a one-hit-wonder. I used to be on a gradual path earlier than the followers got here alongside and grabbed onto the hit, then dipped. It’s been bizarre to navigate. And it was exhausting to not be capable of tour when it was huge. I noticed after how depressed I used to be about shedding that chance. Because that’s the second once you join with folks and chase that.
That’s what this album is. It’s rising up and waking as much as these huge questions that I don’t even have the solutions to.
How did you develop your self-trust? You maintain going again to your self and what you understand. That’s not one thing lots of people have. Have you all the time felt that method?
[Remember] issues are working. Whatever you’re doing is working. You can collaborate with folks or get recommendation from folks, however to really apply it your self is totally different. Part of it’s stubbornness and gas of ego. It’s a bizarre inventive ego of additionally hating your self on the similar time. When you’re making artwork or writing or portray, you gained’t essentially write it from another person’s perspective. If I’m Picasso and portray, I’m not asking somebody random for recommendation? But I’ve develop into extra open to collaborating this 12 months. I’ve been very insular previously. Michael Jackson labored with Quincy Jones loads and Elton John labored with a author. All these large artists who’ve the most effective music didn’t essentially make it alone. Finding the proper collaborators is essential. They will help seize what you’re about and put it in your story. I used to be 17 once I began making music. If I had been working with totally different collaborators, it might’ve been a special story. My collaborators allowed me to be myself. And that’s why I belief the intestine. You should belief it greater than you assume.
If there was a sense or power or message that listeners might take away after listening to the album, what do you hope it’s? What do you need to transmute their method?
I hope they see it as a filter. Like life by a special lens. I labored actually exhausting to make it this fashion. I would like them to see the wonder and contrasting feelings. It’s polar opposites at instances. I hope they hear and watch and really feel impressed. If issues are extra mundane, possibly they will see them in a special mild. Look at a bug and don’t squish it, you understand? I hope they really feel consolation. I hope they really feel heard. I would like them to enter one other world. This album was so intentional, which I haven’t carried out but. This one is cohesive. I’m already considering of future tasks. This one is narrative, I’m following themes of obsession, breakdown, chaos and ascent. In that order. That’s the story and people are the modifications. The subsequent physique will probably be one thing new. It’ll be a special approach to evolve as an artist. I’m already desirous about it.
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